Get ready for a fast-moving show that will offer you a brand-new perspective on dating, self-worth, and self-love. In this episode, Jonathon Aslay reveals why dating itself can trigger our deepest fears, shares the 4 Pillars of A Successful Relationship, and breaks down the ways in which we can transcend the flawed modern dating scene to have deeper, more meaningful, more successful dates and long-term romantic partnerships. And it starts with the common denominator in all of your failed relationships: you!
That’s right, dating success starts with cultivating self-love and healing childhood trauma. Jonathon is the author of What The Heck Is Self-Love Anyway, a book about healing from grief and childhood trauma to cultivate self-love. Jonathon leverages his message to the unique challenges of the modern dating scene. He is a dating coach specializing in mid-life and purposeful dating ― helping clients transcend the usual obsession with chemistry to become more self-aware and understand what Jonathon calls the 4 Pillars of successful relationships: Chemistry, Common Values, Blendable Lifestyles, and Emotional Maturity. Jonathon is the real deal, having overcome an assortment of personal setbacks to rebuild his life and gift his message to others. After losing his 19-year-old son Connor in 2018, Jonathon was forced to acknowledge what he’s suspected all along: that dating strategies are often too one-dimensional to have a meaningful impact. Instead, it’s the act of dating itself that brings out what he feels is the number one emotional health issue facing singles today: a soul-deep lack of self-worth and self-love.
Today, Jonathon is on a mission to encourage both men and women to adopt a daily practice of self-help, personal development, and spirituality, so that they may find true inner happiness, purpose, and peace. With these practices, individuals will attract the relationship of their dreams — and Jonathon is here to help along the way.
Enjoy listening to this fun, informative (and quite useful!) show with Jonathon, and if you want to connect with him or learn more about his work, check out his website here.
Jonathan Aslay is a dating coach and expert specializing in midlife and purposeful dating. [01:38]
Jonathan’s four pillars for successful dating are chemistry, shared values, a blendable lifestyle, and emotional maturity. [03:00]
In the dating realm, old memories of “I’m not good enough” or “I’m not lovable” come up. [05:15]
After using the dating profile system, Jonathan realized that he was good at interpreting both men’s and women’s profiles and that’s how his business came about. [07:35]
The greater issue in dating is not just biology and attraction, it is more a healing of our childhood wounds and traumas. [08:44]
Emotional maturity is one of the key pillars of a relationship. If people don’t take responsibility for their choices, they are not emotionally mature. [11:12]
The physical connection is nice but to sustain a long-term relationship, you need the blendable lifestyles. [16:33]
Romance should be reserved for relationships and not just for dating. [18:13]
More women than men ask for help from this dating coach. [21:22]
In modern times, the way people meet and get together is so different from the past. [23:15]
It took Jonathan over 100 failed dates to realize the common denominator in them all was Jonathan himself. [27:23]
Self-love means self-worth, self-confidence, self-esteem, self-reliance, self-respect. [23:45]
Can we assume that most everyone has some wounds from their childhood upbringing and are lingering? [30:54]
We can either look inward or look to blame the outside world. [31:58]
Sadly, people are dating myopically….just thinking about what am I getting here? rather than respecting the other’s feelings. [41:18]
Ask value-based questions on that first date. [46:38]
It is important to be honest and straightforward in communicating how you see the relationship. Are you looking for a partner? Are you just having fun? Benefits? [52:40]
It’s not necessarily rejection. It is misalignment. It is an awareness. [54:09]
Biology makes up a small percentage of the other person’s personality. [56:15]
Meeting up with a stranger is a challenge, these days. [01:04:41]
- Jonathan Aslay
- Jonathan Aslay on YouTube
- What the Heck is Self-Love Anyway?
- Getting the Love You Want.
- Paradox of Choice
- Shut Up, Stop Whining and Get a Life.
- Eight Dates
- Are You the Right One for Me?
- “When it comes to relationships, people follow patterns mostly based on their childhood upbringing. That affects our love attachment style, which is how we bond with other human beings based on these wounds and traumas.”
- “It’s good to feel chemistry on a physical and emotional level, but also have an awareness that we can bond with a partner that may not be healthy with us.”
- “I call self-love a vaccination to emotional chaos.”
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Get Over Yourself Podcast
Brad (1m 38s): Introducing the high energy Jonathan Aslay, author of What the Heck is Self Love Anyway?, This guy is a dating coach and expert specializing in midlife and purposeful dating. And he has an interesting backstory. He’s gone through some tragedies and some losses and a lot of self reflection. And his theme is that dating brings out triggers our deepest fears that we’re not good enough, right? What else could put you on display more so than clicking that link to put your profile live or going out on that first date? Brad (2m 20s): And he says, we’re kind of setting ourselves up for a lot of failure and disappointment with the traditional model. So he gives a whole bunch of interesting insights in this fast moving show about how to evolve the dating process, how to be the best you can be. And that entails cultivating self love. First, before you put yourself out there and have perhaps a selfish approach to dating. If you don’t have that self love as a starting point, that means healing from childhood trauma and becoming more aware, Oh, it’s a great show filled with a whole bunch of good suggestions for reading, including his own book, but many others. Well-read guy with all kinds of ready insights. I love his Four pillars of a successful relationship. Brad (3m 3s): So it’s not just for dating a lot of relationship advice too. And I’ll give you this little tidbit to make sure that you listen to this awesome show with Jonathan Azlan. The four pillars are first of course, chemistry, but a lot of times that’s overvalued or it clouds out the other ones. And the second one is shared values, right? About health or political, whatever it is to make it a smooth and easy fit. The next one is blendable lifestyle. So again has to work out on a practical level and finally the big one, emotional maturity. Ah! Put those four together and you have a chance for success. Let’s hear more from Jonathan Aslay Jonathan Aslay. I got you, man. Brad (3m 44s): I’m sorry for you. I was a no show. I pride myself on being punctual. I had no idea what time it was and here you are smiling after waiting for me. And I got you warmed up. You have some really interesting things to say, and I think we’re going to, we’re going to get right into it. You’re the author of What the Heck is Self Love Anyway? and have a lot to say about the dating scene and maybe some opinions that are counter to some other experts that we’ve had on the show. So we’re gonna have some fun, man. Jonathan (4m 15s): I’m excited. Thanks so much for having me. I’m just jazzed. And for the record, I appreciate you getting, helping me get out of bed and take a shower. So no worries on being late. Brad (4m 24s): I hope you’re in Hawaii or something then, cause we’re not too early, but whatever. Jonathan (4m 29s): We keep our own schedule. So you sent me this beautiful email and I’d love for you to tell the audience a little bit about this backstory and how you got to this position of, you know, what you’re communicating in your books. Yeah. So thank you so much. I appreciate the opportunity. So professionally I’m a dating and relationship coach and how that journey began really quickly is after going through a divorce and finding myself single, I did this thing called internet dating, and I do that in quotes because I thought it was really simple. You could just magically put in, or you can put in what you want and someone would magically appear. And after a hundred unsuccessful internet dates in one year, Brad (5m 11s): come on, Are you embellishing their UN on a hundred dates in one year? Jonathan (5m 15s): That’s, that’s an actual number. I was literally going out on two dates a week on average, sometimes two in a day. But what I realized after a hundred dates was there was the problem. Wasn’t the dates. The problem was me. I was the common denominator. So I began a journey of personal development, self-help, and spiritual work. And what that eventually prepared me for was, and I’m fast forwarding my story because in July of 2018, I lost my 19 year old son. And anyone who’s a parent, anyone listening to this note, anyone can empathize with, you know, losing a child is the worst that can happen to a parent. Jonathan (5m 59s): And in the depths of my pain, I was at his funeral giving the eulogy and I stopped. And I turned to everyone in the audience and I said, look, I’m going to make a conscious choice to grieve with love. I’m gonna make a conscious choice to grieve?with love. And from that moment, I began a deep dive into what does it really mean to love both ourselves and others? And I began, you know, I literally didn’t work for a year and a half. I began writing a book literally days. I mean, two weeks, two months after he passed away, I began writing my second book published at nine months to the day later called What the Heck is Self Love Anyway? And it’s a journey of personal development self-help and spiritual work as a way as an antidote to inner suffering. Jonathan (6m 46s): And I call it a vaccination to emotional chaos and why this is so critical in the dating realm is dating and relationships trigger the number one emotional health issue facing most everyone. And that is, I’m not good enough. I’m not lovable and I’m not likable. And that’s what I really am jazzed to talk about because love is the antidote to all that. Brad (7m 10s): Certainly it makes sense that dating is the trigger of your deepest fears because you’re putting yourself out there. I think from the very starting point of clicking the button to sign up and create a profile and, you know, take that, take that massive leap. So tell me about your leap that you took. And then, then you went into the, the high volume operation there in that first year. Jonathan (7m 35s): ,Well, what, you know, when I, what, what was interesting is I told you I went on a hundred internet dates, but what I was really doing was talking, I was addicted to online dating. I was a serial dater. I was talking to women on the phone all over the country. You know, sometimes I had six instant messages going at one time talking to women because I was addicted to the feminine energy. I was addicted to talking to women, but not from a dating perspective, I just wanted to connect. But what was happening, Brad, is I was talking to him like his friends. And pretty soon some of them there was never a date. I mean, again, I was talking to women all over the country. Jonathan (8m 15s): They would go, Hey, Jonathan, will you check out my profile and help me make it better. And I’m like, sure. So, so I’d give them some advice and then they changed their profile. And then three weeks later, I get the phone call, Hey, Jonathan, I’ve got this great date. Will you check out the guy’s profile and tell me what you think of him? And I realized that after a while I had a knack for profiling guys and I jokingly say, do you know how the FBI have profilers for serial killers? Brad (8m 43s): Right, right. Jonathan (8m 44s): I can profile serial dater, serial, monogamous, nice guys, bad boys. And the guy looking for you. And that’s how my business was literally helping women improve their profiles. But in the same, as I shared before, how this was doing a deep dive on personal development? And I recognized that the real greater issue in dating, mating and relating isn’t, you know, biology and attraction, it’s more a healing, our childhood wounds and traumas that we both what we experienced in childhood and in adulthood. So I’m more of a proponent of understanding human behavior than it is the biology of relationships. Brad (9m 27s): Yes, we hear that often that a lot of times we’re trying to heal those wounds by repeating the story. So we, the, the, the adult children of alcoholics will have a high propensity to find someone who has a substance abuse and, and relive the, even though it was perhaps a, a negative or, you know, a harmful subconscious stored memory. Why does that happen? And what can we do about it? Jonathan (9m 54s): By the way, a great book by Harville Hendrix is called Getting the Love You Want. And it’s understanding why we tend to, you know, there’s the, what’s the phrase, the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, expecting different results. Well, when it comes to relationships, people follow patterns, mostly based on their childhood upbringing. And certainly that also affects our what’s called love attachment style. And love attachment style is how we bond to another human being based on these wounds and traumas. So a great book also to read is called Attached by Amir Levine. And for those that are seeking a romantic relationship, I highly encouraged to really do a deep dive on the books that I recommend, because I think at least, and I say the books I recommend because I’ve, I’ve read so many different books and I’ve kind of narrowed down some of the best ones to help people make better choices in their lives. Jonathan (10m 52s): So Brad (10m 53s): I don’t think it’s as simple as looking at your childhood example and repeating exactly what you saw with your own parents or your, your own product of divorce. There’s something there’s some different factors in play here, right? You’re maybe going to do the exact opposite of what you saw in childhood or something? Jonathan (11m 11s): Well, so we either adopt a behavior of our parent, or we reject a behavior of our parents. So, and, and we’re talking and our parents have multiple multiple behaviors. So it might be one behavior we’ve adopted like our parent. There’s another behavior that we reject. So, and this carries through in who we pick is mates, oftentimes. So it’s just, it’s really, what’s most important about reading these books is to create a level of awareness. Because when you’re aware of a pattern, you get to have the choice. Do I want to repeat this pattern? And sadly, most humans, especially here in the United States, are sucking on the nipple of victim hood. Jonathan (11m 52s): Now their victim consciousness, like they don’t take personal responsibility for their choices. Brad (11m 58s): Why the United States, man, what have we got? What’s our issue. We got a lot of international listeners too, so they can be smug right now while Jonathan tells us why they were we’re all victims. Jonathan (12m 9s): Well, first off victim consciousness, let me, well, because we have a propensity of it for one thing. This is again just my perception. But you know, smaller countries that have more of a similar values with like United States is a melting pot of so many different values. We certainly have a divided country where half the population, you know, is Democrat. Half the population is Republican and they’re, they’re really rigid in their ideology. So that’s where I’m differentiating between smaller countries here now I’m not saying that people don’t have their differences, but we really have it because social media and our, and our entertainment industries and such like now just pouring out so much content. Jonathan (12m 56s): Whereas I think in those smaller countries, it’s more, it’s more fam it’s more value based. It’s more family-based now that’s not an absolute, it’s just an observation. Brad (13m 6s): Sure, sure. So it’s seems like, I mean, your, your theme here is that underlying this flawed model of dating are a bunch of people carrying around some baggage, maybe not feeling worthy enough because they have these stored memories. And that’s what we want to break through. And I suppose become more authentic and more self aware before we even put up our lousy profile. Jonathan. Jonathan (13m 32s): Exactly. Now here’s the thing most people have bought into the fantasy that chemistry equals relationship success. In other words, if we have chemistry for the moment that is a guaranteed relationship success, and I can say, Brad, that the bodies are piled from here to the moon, which is a lot of bodies of where that wasn’t the case. And so having an awareness and I talk about the four pillars of relationships, success, A chemistry is important. I don’t want to discount that shared values is hugely important because if two people don’t share the same values, it’s going to be problematic and I’ll use your expertise. Jonathan (14m 13s): You know, when it comes to health, you know, someone who believes in health and it’s important to them is probably not going to get, you know, really be excited about dating someone who’s a chain smoker and eats processed foods all day long. And that’s because that’s really a value in my opinion. But, and there’s more to that. The third is blendable lifestyles. Blendable lifestyles, many people are dating where their lifestyles are so not capable of blending together, but they have this fantasy, but if we love each other, we’ll make it work out, or which is really just that chemical reaction. And then the fourth and the most important piece is emotional maturity. Jonathan (14m 53s): And as I said before, the vast majority of the population doesn’t take personal responsibility for their choices. And that’s a sign of emotional maturity as well as some other factors as well. Brad (15m 5s): Those are a great four pillars. I love that, man. And let me guess what the chemistry is that going to wash out the other three for a certain period of time before they even become exposed?, Jonathan (15m 16s): So think of chemistry, what’s the word, chemistry, chemical. What is chemical? Chemicals being released in our brain. Oxytocin, dopamine, testosterone, estrogen, all these chemicals are being released and it’s like a, it’s a drug. So right in the beginning, the love drug, you know, Cupid’s arrow, all those sorts of things. That’s either lust or limerence, it’s not love. And so having an awareness around this it’s important, you know, it’s good to feel chemistry on a physical and an emotional level, but also have an awareness that we could bond with a partner that may not be healthy with us for us, excuse me. Jonathan (15m 57s): And so it’s really important to have a level of awareness and consciousness around those for most, for those three other pillars that I talk about. Brad (16m 7s): So I wonder when you were getting started with your live six live chats, going at the same time and being more buddy, buddy, maybe you were kind of drifting over to a heightened self-awareness where you realized it was more than just chemistry. Cause seemingly when you first start and you go on your first date and you’re interacting, you’re probably trying to just spark that that need to be wanted and all those things that are superficial. Jonathan (16m 32s): Yeah. And I’m, I’m gonna own that as a man. Men tend to be, you know, you know, there’s this concept. Men are hunters and chasers, right? But I’m here to say, what are we hunting and chasing? Are we hunting the following? I want to be in a relationship. I want to be in like men, aren’t hunting that, what are we hunting? Physical connection. That’s what we’re hunting. And so in the beginning I was hunting physical connection. I feel that dopamine rush. I’d have sex with a woman and I’m not proud of what I’m about to say. And then all of a sudden I’d go, why don’t I like her anymore? Like literally I had this awareness because as minute as soon as that was satiated, all of a sudden the chemicals were gone. Jonathan (17m 17s): And it took me some years to recognize that that was what was actually happening. And so now I’m not driven by the biological component of relationships. I’m, I’m driven more by seeing the bigger picture. Brad (17m 31s): Right. So what we want to achieve is to sustain that romantic spark, which John Gray talks about is so important. John Gottman, all the other experts are saying that this is possible to sustain for a longterm marriage, but you also want to have those other things in play so that you’re not annoyed being in same house as the person or having these disparate lifestyles that cause so much, I guess, stress and, and, you know, lead to break up. But that’s, I think what’s going on with the celebrities where you have the power couple, and then someone’s off shooting a movie for five months with another leading lady. And then those guys are on the magazine the next month. It seems really difficult to sustain when you have those disparate lifestyles. Jonathan (18m 13s): Yeah. And that’s kind of the exception, not the rule for the most part, you know, the average person, but that’s certainly they can fall into that trap. You know, I, I’m a believer of the following. Romance should be reserved for relationships and not for dating.I am going to repeat that. Romance should be reserved for relationships and not as a precursor to get into it, you know, into a relationship because this, because here’s what happens. Romance. It’s like, Hey, I need to convince you to like me. So I’m going to do these romantic things. And what happens is, as soon as you like me, I’m not going to do those things anymore because I got what I wanted. Okay. Now I’m saying on a subconscious level, that’s why I’m more of a proponent is, is romance is reserved for an ongoing relationship and to be conscious and have a daily practice of attention, affection and appreciation as your relationship is developed and not as a precursor to get into a relationship. Brad (19m 10s): I like that. So let’s, let’s take that to the rewind, to the, the internet dating scene, which you have a lot to say about, and we’ll, we’ll get some tips and tricks going, but let’s say that you’re just in the early stages there and you’re going to go meet for the first date. It’s just coffee. Like they say, in the airport, it’s just lunch in the airplane magazine or the, the coffee meeting place is the safe and secure one at mid day. So you can leave after 27 minutes. Now, if we’re going in date, number one, date, number two, date number three. Are you suggesting there’s a little bit of a need to hold back and not throw the 12 flowers in right away and just kind of get more, a little more low key than we’re usually used to seeing. Jonathan (19m 55s): Yeah. So that’s a great question. I’m going to kind of cover that in a few different ways. So Brad (19m 60s): Rambling Brad Kearns question with five different angles, you can take it away. I love it. Jonathan (20m 4s): So right off the bat, let’s with that scenario, you’re most likely 99.9% of the time meeting a stranger. Okay. You’re meeting a total stranger, which is unlike the past when we used to meet people in the villages we lived in or the tribe or the small town or the workplace. Whole different way of connecting with another human being. So here’s the challenge. When you literally only have 27 minutes to make a decision, it’s almost always going to be based on energetic connection and chemistry. In other words, you’re not going to most likely want to invest time unless there’s something there Brad (20m 42s): I see. So that’s always the first gateway and you always hear about that right now. Jonathan (20m 48s): It didn’t use to be that way, because if you, if you got to know someone over a period of time, you would actually fall in love with who they were. And not that you know, that that perception, because literally you have 27 minutes to make literally at 27 and a half microseconds to make a decision because that’s what happens in the first three seconds, right? Is that decision based on what you see right from the get go? Most people. Brad (21m 13s): Is that so? You’re going to detect a lack of chemistry or chemistry In the first, in the first few seconds. Jonathan (21m 21s): Most people, when you’re meeting someone for the first time, you’re going to make a snap judgment based on physical attraction. Now that’s not always the case, but that’s most of the time the case and how much you’re willing to invest is going to be based on how much, how attracted you are. For example, I work, I work with women there. So my in my practice is mostly people. Over 40 years old, Brad (21m 42s): You work with only women or mostly women? Jonathan (21m 45s): I’d say 99.9% of the time, the people who hire me are women. Brad (21m 49s): That’s interesting. Jonathan (21m 50s): Not often a guy reaches out for my support. Brad (21m 53s): Why do you think that is before you tell me about your work with women? That’s very interesting. Jonathan (21m 57s): Well, I’m going to give you a great analogy. So men are more like take, for example, when it comes to directions, right? Guys, rarely ever ask for directions, they figure they can. They mostly figure they can do it themselves. Brad (22m 11s): The guy in the gas station that knows the route and the only people that come here Jonathan (22m 17s): By the way, women are more fascinated with why men do blank. They’re more fascinated with the why men are more interested in this. How do I meet a girl? And they’re bigger. They’re their challenge is mostly centered around confidence. That’s where men are centered around. Women are all fascinated with the why that’s that’s one of the reasons why relationship books are purchased by women too, you know, nine out of 10 times compared to men, men just buy books. How do I meet girls? I’m not saying all men, but the vast majority of men, right? Or let me reframe rephrase that. The vast majority of women are the ones who buy the books that are relationship oriented. Brad (23m 3s): So in your practice, I interrupted you. You said you work with mostly women. Jonathan (23m 8s): Yeah. And now I lost my train of thought where, well, Brad (23m 13s): We were talking about meeting strangers. .So what happens is women will make a snap judgment of whether they not like a guy or not. And what’s interesting. And I’ve heard the phrase, men fall in love through their eyes and women fall in love between their ears. But in today’s dating realm, we’re making such quick decisions that women are making a step judgment based on their eyes too. This is why a lot of people have a lot of first dates that never go anywhere. So it’s physical attraction. Jonathan (23m 45s): Right. And then at some point that seeds into the background, like you described easy for the man to relate to, and I suppose, for the women as well. Yeah. And then, then what, then you got nothing to say. And so the thing winds down, I guess exactly. But if two people are energetically connected and attracted to one another, they’re more apt to say, you know, man’s more apt to say, Hey, let’s go on another date and, you know, get together with them. But in today’s world, we’re seeing a lot of people having first or second dates that never go anywhere, which didn’t use to be the case. When my mother, like this is a picture of my mom and dad who were got, you know, they met in the forties, right. Jonathan (24m 28s): Whole different ball game. Then today there wasn’t the internet there wasn’t social media, there wasn’t chat rooms and the list goes on and on. Brad (24m 37s): So I guess one of the big reasons that we flame out after one or two dates is the incredible opportunity to engage further and have more, more choice rather than the old story from the, the farming village, where there was a, you know, only three prospects are, I went to a private middle school and we had, you know, 22 people in our graduating class. So there wasn’t a whole lot of, you know, opportunity to continue to move swiping with your finger to a new prospect. Jonathan (25m 8s): Well, we used to have two things, you know, most relationship decisions, you know, that go back 50 plus a hundred years ago was based on scarcity and proximity, scarcity and proximity. In other words, it was literally the only if you could see them in your purview and all you could see was more people. So that’s all you chose from now because of this little device, we have access to tens of thousands of people all across the country. Brad (25m 35s): And you’ve got three messages on there. When you show me on, we’re filming this for YouTube, okay. I get back to the show back to the show, Jonathan (25m 42s): And now there’s the paradox of choice. And there’s a great Ted talk on this for those. Just Google Paradox of Choice, but it’s so relates to the dating mating and relating round because we have this perceived choice. In other words, we have many people have this perceived, well, this person didn’t work out. So there’s just an abundance of more people. And again, in that trap of like, you know, going from one to the next next, because they always think, Oh, there’s always someone better, Brad (26m 12s): Right. So there’s a positive aspects of this, the freedom and the opportunity to engage with more people. And then there’s that paradox of choice, which one of the insights I pulled from this idea that we have abundant choice today is that it’s more stressful and we feel less satisfied. The example was buying a car. And if you go look at 36 different car dealerships and you buy one, you drive away feeling less satisfied than the person who goes to three because it’s just too overwhelming. And I would imagine the same thing with the dating and trying to sustain a relationship past the two month mark or the, or the one year mark or something. Jonathan (26m 50s): Yeah. You know, it’s, it’s fascinating. Cause as you’re sharing that and I have to go buy a new car relatively soon and I’m thinking of all the different options and it’s really freaking me out. I, I I’d much, in fact, I’ll probably just stick with the same car and leasing, you know, the same car and, you know, deal with it that way. But then again, the cars just to get to and from, it’s not a reflection of who I am. So Brad (27m 12s): It looks the same out the front windshield, almost any car, you see a hood and you see the road. Jonathan (27m 16s): Yeah, exactly. Brad (27m 19s): Okay. So in your own experience here, you had this awakening, you had the tragedy in your life and you’re out there trying to date and sort things out. And then I think you described how you uncovered the, the common denominator in all the a hundred failed dates, which was Jonathan, right? The only thing that’s unique to every situation. So where did it go from there and how was the, you know, the transformation so that you could kind of cultivate this self love and be a better, better prospect for dating on, in both directions, a prospect for someone and, and then also yourself? Jonathan (27m 60s): Yeah. Thanks for asking. So, you know, it’s interesting is even though I had this awareness, I was the common denominator. It still took a lot of work to get to where I’m at today and I’m going to be, I’m very grateful for an experience. I had a met a fantastic woman in January of 2011. We went on a journey together to, we were, and I say a journey together. We were in relationship for six years now. I want to be candid. There was some on and off periods in there too. So because we were individually still healing from our own wounds and traumas that happened in our life. There was a lot of work going on in my life and her life. And so while we weren’t, we didn’t end up in partnership together. Jonathan (28m 42s): Eventually we thankfully were, were, or we’re dear friends, we’re actually family to one another now. It was that experience. And I’m going to say it was a woman who opened my heart up. I was so grateful. In fact, this is a woman who was a doctor, a therapist. She used to have her own TV show called Straight from the Heart. I mean, this is a woman with a big gigantic heart and her heart opened my heart up. And while I wasn’t really in a place to fully commit and, and, and nor was she in our particular case she really broke my heart open to recognizing the value of compassion, the value of generosity, the value of appreciation. Jonathan (29m 25s): It was through that experience that I really tapped into my own heart. So when she and I ended three years ago, I actually, she gifted me for my birthday was the Hoffman process. And for those who aren’t familiar with, it is an amazing inner child workshop where you get to truly do a deep dive on healing, childhood wounds that were reflection of your parenting upbringing. And, and after that, I started to do even a deeper dive into healing, who I was as a person. So, but then what happened to me? I lost my mother a few months after that. And then I lost my son. Jonathan (30m 5s): So, and during that period, I really could cocooned and began doing a deeper dive into loving myself. And for some people, the word self-love might be a turnoff. So let me help you with this word. Self-love means self worth, self confidence, self esteem, self-reliance, self-respect. It’s all incorporated in the idea of loving oneself, because there’s a saying, if you can’t love yourself, how can you love another? And that’s where I’ve been on the last three years. And I feel like I’ve reached that place. I’ve got solid ground underneath me to explore a new relationship and partnership, quite frankly. Brad (30m 45s): So we could assume that most everyone has some wounds from childhood that are lingering in there and deserving of letting go. And we could all probably relate how we had a rough time, one way or the other, whether it was being bullied or having, you know, abandonment things happening. But at a certain point, there’s also some recommendations out there to, you know, wake up, pick yourself up off the ground, quit crying about it. And so we can’t get into individual therapy on the show, but as in some general, some general ideas, maybe you could offer up for someone who, you know, might want to go down that route and do a little exploring about how this childhood programming is affecting their day to day activity as adults. Jonathan (31m 38s): Yeah. You know, there’s a, I’m so glad you brought this up because it reminds me of a book I read called Shut Up, Stop Whining, and Get a Life, by Larry Winget I believe is his name. Brad (31m 47s): Geez! I’ll have to try to remember that title. Jonathan (31m 49s): Wow. Shut Up, Stop Whining, and Get a Life. Brad (31m 52s): Okay. I remember it. Jonathan (31m 53s): Yeah. So what I liked, so what the element of the title itself is like, look, it’s self-responsibility, it’s self discipline, it’s self respect. And ultimately, when I remember when I was sharing about the dating, the multiple dates, I was the common denominator. I look at inner peace as my barometer. If I’m not feeling relatively inner peace, and I’m feeling, you know, anxiety, depression, all those things. What I do Is to look inward and say, okay, what can I do to heal myself? And as I said before, the vast majority of the population says somebody else has to heal me to feel, I need you to love me to feel good about myself. Jonathan (32m 33s): I mean, that’s literally the way the vast majority operates. And so introspective work first, a catalyst. And I believe it takes humbling moments to actually to have experienced those catalysts. My humbling moment was when I lost my quarter million dollar a year job, and I got divorced and then I got wiped out in the market crash. Those were some big humbling moments. And then there were more hump than when losing my mom and losing my son. Another humbling moment. I think it’s through those experiences that we have a choice. I can either look inward or I can blame the outside world. And those who look inward tend to, to do better in life than those that projected outward. Brad (33m 23s): I would say that’s pretty obvious. And anyone who’s stuck reciting a story about how they got screwed by the market downfall or the job that they lost. They will remain stuck there until They heat up. They create a catalyst of looking at the thing differently, Jonathan (33m 40s): But here’s the thing about stuck ego. The unhealthy ego can keep you there for a very long time. It takes a level of being going, wait a minute. My unhappiness is because of me, not because I got cheated on not because I got ghosted, not because I was with a narcissist, not because of blah, blah. You know, my, my company laid me off or whatnot. It’s looking at you have the power or we individually have the power to take charge of our own destiny. We just have to want to do that. And it takes a level of self discipline to get there. So shut up, stop whining, and get a life. Brad (34m 18s): Yeah. So look at that common denominator because it’s pretty difficult to, you know, extract yourself from all the stories and all the wrongs that have happened to you with your failed relationships, your string of failed relationships, but you can’t deny that you’re the common denominator. And so that’s a, that’s a good starting point. I can’t think of a better catalyst than to just ask that question. Like what was, what was similar amongst these eight women that you, you flamed out with? Oh, okay. That’s right. You were on the other side of the coin. Wow. Jonathan (34m 49s): I have a theory and this is going to offend a few people, but let me just say it anyway. I think instead of going to church every Sunday, for those that do, I think you should, people should go to a funeral every Sunday. And let me explain why, because what happens when you go to a funeral you’re literally standing outside in the reception hall after hearing the beautiful eulogies about people you cared about. And most people say I’m not going to waste one more minute of my life. Literally the vast majority of people say that, you know, to themselves. And three days later, they’re back to their old patterns. But for a few short minutes, you’re going to take people, take charge of their destiny. Jonathan (35m 30s): And then they go back to a pattern that they’re going back to. The pattern is the self discipline. It’s saying I’m going to make a change in my life and I’m going to stick with it. That’s self discipline. And that relates to the health. You know, we were talking about before about the healthy eating and healthy lifestyle. It takes self discipline. Brad (35m 49s): Right. I guess we all have an assortment of catalysts thrown at us over the past five years that we can reference every time you get ghosted or whatever, you’re going to have a tiny little catalyst there to pick yourself up and say, Hey, I, you know, I deserve to go to the gym today and eat healthy. And then we’ll check in with you in, in 60 days and everything’s back to the same square. So to leverage that, that spark and keep it going and keep that self worth intact, I think is that’s probably the, the, the content of your book. Are you walking people through a strategy like this? Jonathan (36m 28s): Well, I have about, I have 30 different lessons that take you through. It’s really a journey of beginning of personal development, self-help and spiritual practice. But for example, chapter one of my book is called speak your truth. Do it with kindness. And what that simply means is our truth is our, is our feelings. Our feelings are our truth. That doesn’t mean it’s the truth. It’s just your truth. And oftentimes people share their truth, but in a very combative or controvert or combative way versus, or confrontational way versus a, this is my truth. I’m just gonna say it in a nice way that I feel is a more healthier way to approach communication. Jonathan (37m 12s): That is one example, Another example in my book relates to your body is a machine, not a temple, for example. Brad (37m 20s): Yeah. I’ve never heard that one, man. What’s all about? Jonathan (37m 23s): What happened was you might appreciate this. So I went on a journey of looking at food differently a couple years ago. I thought, you know, and I started to watch every documentary. I could get my eyes on and I recognized that our body is a machine really.’sAnd what we feed our, this machine will affect how, you know, how we feel, what energy levels we have, how we look. So, you know, by making it a temple, you’re almost elevating it to like, ah, status. And I’m like, Hey, just look at it. Like you would your car. Do you want to put crappy stuff in your car’sgasoline tank? Or do you want to put good things? And that’s my invitation is to put good things in your body. Jonathan (38m 6s): And certainly I encourage everyone to watch read about food because food is simply fuel. And that’s my invitation in that chapter. As an example, another chapter relates to money. It’s called be a good steward of your money. We talked about the United States. I said, you know, we are a country that lives more in debt. You know, the average person, I think 80% of the population has barely two months savings in their bank erccount to cover, you know, COVID wipe out Brad (38m 40s): The top three, wealthiest Americans have more money than the, the bottom 50% combined stuff. Right? Jonathan (38m 47s): Yeah. And so being a good steward of your money is saying, look, I don’t have to live off of, you know, I don’t have to live beyond my means. And it’s just an invitation in that chapter. So self love is both your, you know, your heart, your body, your spirit. And I just take people on a journey of maybe having a little wake up call to begin that daily practice that I encourage at the end of the book, Brad (39m 12s): That’s gonna make you a better partner or dater as well. If you’re responsible with your money and you have your s**t together, so to speak. Jonathan (39m 20s): Yeah. And by the way, when I told you I was in a six year relationship, I’m going to tell you I met her. I was at the bottom of my life, but I’d been turning up and why I want to share this was, I had, remember I told you I lost my quarter million dollar your job. I lost the seven figure net worth in the market crash. And at as 40 a 40 year old man, I had to go with, live with my mom and dad. By the way, I used to live in a $2 million home just to give you some contrast here. And Brad (39m 49s): It’s a little bit of the list in Jonathan’s life. My Goodness. Jonathan (39m 53s): But I was here. I’d started my dating practice. I started to get a little momentum. I met this woman and she didn’t reject me, even though I was living with mom and dad. So I wasn’t in the solid place I am today. And it wasn’t that she looked at my potential. She just said to herself, I don’t need him to be financially successful to take care of me. And she went on the journey. We just went on a journey to see where it took us. And I’m grateful that she didn’t reject me based on that experience of going, Oh my God, he lives with his mom and he’s, you know, he’s relatively broke. Brad (40m 26s): Oh my gosh. I mean, not only are you grateful, it seems like an absolute necessity for a healthy relationship. And to me, as an observation, we seem to be so caught up in the superficial aspects of, of pairing up and place, you know, a huge emphasis on someone’s means and their, their, their net worth and their, you know, their lifestyle. And this can seems like it sets you up for disappointment again and again, rather than taking care of your own matters, being a good steward of your own money and then seeking to pair up with someone. Obviously you can have longterm prospects and address some of those matters, like, you know, problems with debt or, or, you know, having a steady job. Brad (41m 10s): But boy, that should come pretty far down the line. And I don’t see that in one of your four pillars either. Jonathan (41m 16s): Well, actually, so interestingly enough, I’m, I’m not encouraging dating people that are in chaos in their life either. You know, so, you know, I wasn’t in chaos. I was just in the bottom starting over again. There’s a big difference. If I was in absolute chaos, I would not have been a good partner for anyone. And I don’t think people should choose people in chaos, both financially and other facets of their life. So I just let them heal on their time, not your time, my suggestion, but ultimately, you know, it takes a level of compassion to sit across the table from another human being on a first day and what I I’m, I’m encouraging compassion, but I’m also encouraging something else and that’s respect. Jonathan (42m 5s): And sadly people are dating without respecting the other person’s feelings. Or what I mean to say is they’re dating myopically. In other words, I’m only caring about what I get out of this experience. And a lot of people will enter into relationships who have no business being in relationship. And I think respecting another human being is going, you know what? I know you could get attached to me. So I’m going to make sure that I’m in a place where if I’m going to make this investment, it’s worth it versus, and I’m sorry, a lot of men in particular will allow a woman to get attached to them who has no business being in relationship. Jonathan (42m 45s): And I say this because I call myself a heart protector for women. I, I come across as the big brother and I think of this analogy. Do you remember the, you know, when a guy used to pick up or a high school guy picked up his prom date at the person’s house. Okay. And the big brother answers the door and the big brother goes, look, if you treat my sister like s**t, I’m going to kick your ass. And I would, I wish I could tell every guy, this is what’s going to happen. If you treat my sister like s**t, Brad (43m 18s): Oh, I just saw Den of Thieves, that movie with 50 cent where he does the, the guy go into a separate door of the home. And there’s about 17 of his gangsters in there. They had a little talk and then he goes back to his prom date. That was classic. Jonathan (43m 34s): Brad. I literally brought up that story in a podcast I recorded the other day called, well, I forgot the title of the podcast, but I literally shared that story because it’s a great analogy. And what the father says to the boy. He goes, look, I protected my daughter the last 17 years of her life. And I’m giving you this job for this moment. So you better tell me right now, if you’re not capable of this job of protecting my girl, both on a physical and emotional level, then you better back off right now because my buddies are going to kick the s**t out of you. Now, what was classic goes when the boy left the room and the guys all got together and laughed. You’re the s**t out of here to say you better? Jonathan (44m 16s): You know, I’m here to encourage, look, you should get the s**t kicked out of you. If you treat someone with disrespect. And that’s where, you know, we’re a society where we take people for granted and I’m here to say, it’s got to change. And that’s one of my encouragement is To encourage women to be empowered in their lives. And for this reason alone or this reason amongst many. Brad (44m 41s): Boy, that would certainly be nice to have these kinds of topics come up in the first, second and third date, where the woman could show a little bit of resilience that she’s not going to be a pushover. And then if the man’s, if that 1% of your clients, that that’s male aren’t listing your services, they could try to, you know, come off from the very beginning, showing that they have a concern for the other person’s wellbeing and, and values rather than just trying to woo them and get what they want. And I’m re I’m referencing. I think it’s John Gottman said the three stages of relationship. That stage number one is you’re getting your needs met. Brad (45m 23s): So everything’s great. You’re here. You’re getting some action. Stage number two is you’re meeting the needs of your partner. And that also feels good. And your ego gets inflated because you bought your partner dozen roses and deliver it to work. And then stage three is that your partners needs to become your own. And that’s when you are a real team. And I guess we’re not getting to that stage three very often. And in the dating scene. Jonathan (45m 46s): Yeah, I I’m so glad you brought this up. So dating your most people date, let’s just have fun. Let’s just have fun. As a coach I might say no. Your job is to interrogate that person. Now I’m saying this tongue in cheek. Okay. What I mean by interrogators? You have to be Colombo. You literally have to be looking for those Colombo. If anyone remembers Colombo Brad (46m 11s): for our younger listeners, he was a famous detective on TV, Jonathan (46m 14s): but he was able to listen to the clues to determine whether or not that this person was guilty of the crime. Right? And it’s the same thing. I go under the assumption that most people are, are wounded and have not healed. I just go under that promise. And so I find out, you know, like, Hey, what happened in your last relationship? I, you know, and Oh, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah happened and go, how did you heal from that? My asking really good value based questions. And I love you mentioned John Gottman. I love his book. Eight Dates, Eight Dates. I highly recommend everybody read this because when you understand the mechanics of a successful relationship, then you can start vetting based on, do we share the same values? Jonathan (46m 58s): Are, do we have blendable lifestyles? And is this an emotional grownup? And I always say to women, and I hope you don’t mind me saying this, ladies, if you’re going to allow a penis into a vagina, then on a regular basis, then you’ve make your guide by this book. And you both read it together. And if he’s not willing to do it, he’s not your guy. Brad (47m 19s): Yeah. I think there’s the, These little opportunities, Seemingly trivial events that can become huge character revealing insights. And if you’re paying close attention and boy, once those things come about, I know there’s that saying in the domestic abuse scene where the first time is one time too many, right? Because we know it’s going to continue on. And if you applied that to, you know, routine dating interactions, boy, I think the chemistry clouds out some of those character revealing insights where, you know, this is not the right thing, but if you can pay more attention, boy, you can save yourself. Some, some pain and suffering. Jonathan (48m 1s): Absolutely. There’s a great book by Barbara DeAngelis called right here called Are You the Right One for Me? Brad (48m 8s): And this is like Jonathan’s library show. Jonathan (48m 11s): Let me show you the book attached and the book getting the love you want. Brad (48m 19s): And my, my awesome time stamper and link provider for the shows Gail, my mom, Jonathan (48m 25s): is going to be very busy on this show, tracking down all those books. Well, make sure you include the book. What the Heck is Self-love Anyway? there, because that’s my book. Brad (48m 35s): Well, nice cover. Let’s see. Show that for the, the viewers on YouTube. I love it, man. Very simple. Clean cover. You can’t miss it. Nice picture on the back, Jonathan (48m 43s): by the way, just to, just to share with you. Cause I mentioned the relationship I had this picture was taken at my ex girlfriend’s house by her, her current or her boyfriend-partner. They live together. But he took that photo and I just loved it. And I thought this would be great for the back cover. I happened to be in the same picture. That’s right there. I have why I shared that was we, we transitioned from relationship to family to one another. In fact, I am so grateful because she was there for me when my mother passed away. And then when my son passed away, she was there for me. So why I’m sharing this? Is that just because two people aren’t right for each other doesn’t mean that love. And I don’t mean, you know, sexual type of love. Jonathan (49m 25s): I just mean love can’t exist. And I’d like to think she and I are an example of how we transitioned from partnerships to family and we don’t have to let every relationship go by the wayside. Brad (49m 37s): Well, that’s a nice story. And I imagine if you told that at a first date, you know, that that’s a nice insight that you can be close and connected to even an ex where a lot of times those are just crash and burn stories. So that’s a, you know, it’s quite a quite honorable and I think something that everyone should strive for. And if someone has a problem with it, then they’re not love it, man. Jonathan (50m 2s): Yeah, not that I sit there and vomit it, but I mean, I, because I don’t talk to her as much as I used to partially cause she lives farther away and whatnot. But my point is, this is an important person in my life. Just like my sister and my brother. And so this is a good tell by asking what I said, value based questions. Now, most people will say, don’t ask questions on date, just have fun. And I want to stick my finger down my throat and vomit because The dating process is a process of evaluating whether or not you want to be in relationship with someone then. And if it’s not, if you’re just having fun that you should then pay your own way for dates and just hang out together. But if you’re going to date with the intent of wanting a relationship, then be more conscious and mindful about asking really good value based questions, at least in my humble opinion. Brad (50m 54s): Hmm. That’s interesting because how about taking it from a different direction where you are just out there to have fun because you’re not ready for a relationship now because you’re in intensive therapy and you’re healing childhood wounds, but you have a companion to go for a bike ride on the beach and then go have a burrito. But if you’re having so much fun and you have a nice baseline of mutual respect without the pressure of dating, could you one day then change the conversation? I think we see this in the movies all the time where they’re, you know, they’re out on another, a bike ride and then Someone reaches in for a kiss. So I was thinking of Harry met Sally as a close example. Brad (51m 35s): Not exactly. Jonathan (51m 35s): Yeah. Well here’s the thing. If you’re on a dating site, what’s your purpose for being on? I mean, remember I go back. Most people are meeting strangers. It’s one thing. If you’re, Hey, you’re at a work environment, you’re just getting to know someone totally support, having fun for one other one with one another. But here’s another question who’s paying for the dates because if there’s an expectation and you’re just having fun, you’re just having fun, but I still expect you to pay for my fun. Then it’s not genuine. So I’m a little bit more conscious and mindful of these little factors because some people are just wanting to have fun and I get it. It should be fun. Jonathan (52m 15s): A date should be fun. But what’s your real underlying purpose for it? If it’s just merely to have fun for your own satisfaction, how fair is that to the person who gets attached to you? Remember I talked about respect before, so that’s just, it’s just, I want to create awareness around this. Everybody’s entitled to do what ever they want. You’re on your own journey. This is just my perspective on how the journey could be. Brad (52m 40s): Right, right. And I think the dynamics are different among the youth today. If you read the statistics and talk to a lot of them. And I think that conversation always has to be had, and possibly had numerous times over, over a time period where we’re just, we’re just buddies. We’re just hanging out and then we’re Oh, are we friends with benefits now? Are we something different? And just to keep those communication lines open. So it’s always clear. Cause that’s when you’re talking about heartbreaking and, and all those kinds of things when you’re just ignoring the, some of the elephants in the room. Jonathan (53m 15s): Yeah. I went shot a video. I love this. I call it. “You’re most likely in a friends with benefits relationship, but you just don’t know it.” In other words, a lot of people are you’re you’re in a casual relationship or friend, and I’m not saying it’s conscious, but you’re in that relationship. You just don’t know because you haven’t asked really good questions. And women in particular are afraid of asking questions because they’re afraid of disrupting the relationship. And so one of the chapters in my book is if it’s sincere and from the heart, you can never say the wrong thing to the right person. If it’s sincere and from the heart, you can never say the wrong thing to the right person. Jonathan (53m 55s): So if you sincerely go, Hey, I just want to know what your perspective is on this relationship. Are you open to sharing with me? Cause I’d like to share what mine is. If that scares someone away, they weren’t your guy or girl, Brad (54m 11s): Oh, that’s a beautiful insight. And even getting dumped. Right and you’re heartbroken because you got dumped. But I, when I, when I have my chance, I go in for the kill and I’ll tell that person, well, they did you a favor. And they’re like, what do you mean? You know, they broke my heart and I’m like, well, they, you know, they did it now rather than wasting time or, or anything else. And if you feel like we have to get to that point where we look at things in this manner, rather than stay mired and stuck in these ruts of either, You know, grief and self pity or the ego, I’m thinking you got screwed on the last seventeen relationships. Jonathan (54m 50s): Yeah. You know, there’s a, there’s a, there’s a meme. I think I saw it says “Rejection is God’s protection.” That kind of relates to what you just said. But I’m here to say a lot of people think they got rejected and I’d like to shift that narrative. It was simply a misalignment. That’s all that happened. They weren’t aligned with you. You weren’t aligned with them. And they decided to move on. That’s not being rejected. That’s just an awareness. That’s a misalignment because the person I, and I see this with women, a lot of times they feel like they’ve been rejected or guys feel the same way. But that’s almost, there’s a level of shaming yourself. Like there’s something wrong with you. Jonathan (55m 30s): And there is nothing wrong with anybody. We are humans. We’re fallible. We’re imperfect. You know, we’re irrational, illogical human beings at times. And yet we’re also loving and compassionate and wonderful human beings at the same time. There’s no need to beat yourself up just because someone said, I don’t want to go on this journey with you. Brad (55m 50s): Oh, it’s I think also a way to diffuse accountability and put the blame on someone else. And then you can, you can escape free saying you were rejected. Jonathan (56m 2s): Yeah. Well that’s, I didn’t think of it that way. I mean, now hearing that it makes absolutely sense, but yeah, exactly. In other words, it’s not taking ownership because maybe it was really, the misalignment was cause you need more healing in your life. That’s all. Brad (56m 15s): Oh man, this has been some great stuff before we go. I do want to ask you about something. We talked about offline. Cause John Gray was one of the popular episodes on the podcast. And he comes out the relationship from the biological underpinnings that make men and women different and how those drive all behaviors and motivations. But you said that’s not quite the whole story. And I thought that’s an interesting, interesting perspective. Jonathan (56m 44s): Yeah. So I’ve had this awareness and this is just my perception and no disrespect to John Gray. Cause he’s a bestselling author, amazing human being. However, in the dating realm and the relationship around biology makes up a small percentage of the, of a person’s personality. So penis or vagina, it doesn’t really matter because your personality is made up of your childhood wounds, your traumas, your adult experiences, life experience, life traumas, all of these things make up our personality and we don’t fall in love. I mean, yes, biologically, we need a penis into what we do. I mean, for those heterosexuals, that’s how it works. But the, but the bottom line relationship is based on their personality and their emotional maturity. Jonathan (57m 30s): Emotional maturity. And that’s where I love his advice, but it doesn’t work in the dating realm because it’s a small percentage of it. At least I want to bring attention to those other factors because not all men are the same and not all women are the same. There’s just such you can’t pigeonhole gender based on biology because there’s so much more to a person than their biology. Brad (57m 53s): Yeah. I love this connection. I’m sure if we were having a talk show with, with, with John and the other seat, I feel like this is a beautiful, there’s a way to connect this because you have to have emotional maturity over your male biological drives and your, your female propensity. So I don’t think there’s a conflict, but it’s, it’s a really nice add on to say, look, you may be that a person that wants to get laid and leave the room and move on quickly because that’s how the man regenerates testosterone. That’s an interesting concept. But then if the, if your partner says, why are you getting up so quickly? Can you stay here and hang out for a little, you know, you can kind of, you know, bring some different perspective and then… Brad (58m 37s): Nope, I have to go regenerate my testosterone with a testosterone boosting activities, such as a workout or fixing my motorcycle in the garage. That’s when we can kind of continue to evolve these relationships with heightened awareness. Jonathan (58m 49s): That’s exactly it. So I’m just here to draw attention that while the book is great, it’s only one piece of the puzzle you need to read. Harville Hendrix, Getting the Love You Want and you need to, you don’t need to do anything, but these are my, you deserve to write John. Yeah, exactly. Read attach. So you had to understand attachment style, read the book, Nonviolent Communication by Marshall Rosenberg. So you can learn to communicate your feelings better because it’s the problem is this. I think in the dating realm, when we pitched it as a gender issue, we’ve already created a divide. You might as well say Republicans and Democrats, because it’s not about the gender. It’s about the heart and each human heart is unique in and of itself because of their life experience and not because of their biology. Jonathan (59m 34s): At least that’s my pitch and I’m sticking with it. Brad (59m 38s): I love it. I’m so glad that my listeners got exposed to you. My goal with this show is I want to get you. I want to refer you a male client because 99% to one, I think the males can benefit from this just as well, heading into the dating scene. So if there’s a, a guy listening, who’s single and working the, the apps right now, I know a few of them. I can send the link to this show to a, what would be sort of your pitch to tell them that you can help them in some way with this game. Jonathan (1h 0m 9s): Well, you know what just occurred to me as you’re asking that is, look, I’ll, I’ll help you work on your personal development self-help and spiritual work yourself log work. But the good news is I have a database of women too. So I feel the turn now is closing the deal. People, you know, it just occurred to me is I talked to hundreds of women every month. I just might have someone in my I’m not a matchmaker. So I’m here to say this clearly, but that might be a benefit of, of hiring me. Brad (1h 0m 37s): You’re not a matchmaker, but you wouldn’t put it past you. It’s not against the regulations Jonathan (1h 0m 41s): that I had a client reach out to me and said, I have a great girlfriend for you. And while I did meet, and it wasn’t a love connection, it was just nice to, you know, the other thing is the old fix up doesn’t exist anymore. It was nice to bring it back and experience a level of comfort because again, meeting a stranger is a challenge these days, because in fact, we’re probably more apt to treat a stranger at the grocery store nicer than the strangers we meet on dating sites. Sadly. Brad (1h 1m 13s): Whew. Okay. Let’s turn that around with Jonathan’s help. Where can we connect with you? I know there’s a lot of listeners that are already hooked. Probably a lot of females are going to sign up right away and maybe a couple of males will tip toe over there with that great pitch that he’s got the database ready for you, males. So how do we find you get your books everywhere? Jonathan (1h 1m 32s): I’m sure there’s going to be some links here below, but my, with my name, certainly I’m on YouTube. I have a YouTube channel that’s really taking off. I have a podcast called What Would Love Do? podcasts and we explored life love and the pursuit of inner peace through the eyes of love. Certainly my website, JonathanAslay.com and then I’m on social media and all those places as well. Brad (1h 1m 56s): Jonathan Aslay, thanks for a great show. Jonathan (1h 1m 58s): I appreciate it very much, Brad. Thank you. It’s been an honor. You’re a great interviewer. Brad (1h 2m 9s): Thank you. Thank you for listening to the show. We would love your feedback at firstname.lastname@example.org. And we would also love if you could leave a rating and a review on or wherever you listen to podcasts, I know it’s a hassle. You have to go to desktop iTunes, click on the tab that says ratings and reviews, and then click to rate the show anywhere from five to five stars. And it really helps spread the word so more people can find the show and get over themselves because they need to thanks for doing it.