Enjoy some reflection inspired by my lengthy conversation with Mark Sisson.

This show features extensive color commentary and outright tangents on matters relating to the big themes of Mark’s story. Of particular interest to peak performance enthusiasts are the cultural ideals of entrepreneurism and competitive success, and how we often distort these ideals today. Having worked closely with Mark for a decade and known him for over 30 years, I have a deep appreciation for the attitude and behavior characteristics that make him not only a successful entrepreneur, but also able to actualize his branding motto of “Live Awesome.” Marks calls himself a stress-head at times, and admits to assorted shortcomings and imperfections, but he has a marvelous ability to take both success and failure in stride and keep pursuing his grand mission, with a pure motivation, to help people live healthy, awesome lives.

In contrast to a wise, well-balanced peak performer, we seem to be living in an age characterized by social media overload, self-absorption and self-aggrandizement facilitated by social media overload, extreme consumerism, and assorted other highly offensive disconnects from our genetic expectations for health—hyper-connectivity, insufficient sleep, sun exposure and play time, eating crappy food, and not moving enough throughout the day. Regardless of our level of affluence, many of us suffer from FOMO (fear of missing out) and FOKU, too (fear of keeping up.)

Mark’s entrepreneurial story is quite inspiring, but it’s possible that we have gone overboard glorifying the risk takers and the solo flyers of today. The thought leaders in new media—YouTube sensations like Casey Niestat, and podcasters like Joe Rogan, Tim Ferriss and many others, are communicating a message that might easily be misconstrued because of their rare and unique perspective. The people we are listening to are those compelled to step outside of the mainstream channels, create original content, and promote the crap out of their message until it catches on. They can’t help communicate from their own point of view, and that’s where their greatest value and beauty are found. However, it’s important to appreciate how their values and recommended approach to life might not be a good fit for you. It’s super important to recognize this distortion in modern media. You know, the “life is perfect, wish you were here with me…but you’re not. You’re sitting in your cubicle doing soul-sucking busywork. But anyway, Hawaii is awesome at this time of year” aspects of social media. It’s super important to have some compassion for yourself whenever you feel like your life is not cool or grand enough. With a healthy perspective, you can honor the calling for whatever kind of life feels most comfortable and fulfilling to you. Stay true to your own path, and you will protect yourself the excess of blather, positive energy, self-glorification, and narcissism that prevents you from focusing sufficiently execution, patience, and paying your dues the old fashioned way.

Alert to the prevailing cultural phenomenons of helicopter parents and entitled millennials!: Reflect when Mark comments on the value of investing in yourself, and how there is a shortage today of skilled laborers—perhaps because the millennials don’t want to engage in hard physical labor. You can invest $4k in welding school apprentice training and go make a six-figure income!

Reflecting on all the twists and turns and detours and dead ends in Mark’s journey, it’s possible that the Mark Sisson coming of age today woulda become a doctor. That’s just fine, but it turns out that Mark’s destiny was to save 10 million people from needing a doctor (and the commonplace steady decline into old age and extensive medical care) by making “primal” lifestyle changes that optimize gene expression. Seriously. Look at MDA success stories and the explosive popularity of the ancestral health movement that was fringe and highly criticized at the outset, but has now gained mainstream acceptance. Yes, Mark has had a mission statement of “influencing 10 million people” for over a decade.

Recently, I noticed someone in the health space had repurposed it with a mission to affect 100 million lives. This example is exactly what I’m talkin’ about when I observe that there is too much hype and blather and not enough focus on execution, appreciating the process, and paying one’s dues. Don’t get me wrong, I offer much respect and support to someone with grand ambitions (I forgot where I saw the 100 million message, but much respect to the playah), but a mission statement of helping one person at a time, one day at a time, is perhaps even more laudable than going for the eight-zeroes. Alas, Mark’s once preposterous statement is now emerging as a reality, what with Primal Kitchen products in 9,000 stores and total book sales in the millions of units. Besides, Mark has published a post every day for 12 years in support of actualizing his mission statement.

Indeed, there is backlash to today’s frenzied ethos of “believe in yourself, think positive, dream big, conquer the world!” In the heli-parent scene, we seem to want to force the destiny of our golden children today—make every kid valedictorian (impossible, but at a recent high school graduation I noticed 13 of them…I don’t recall that happening back in the day, do you?) or mold every little athlete into a superstar with an NCAA division 1 scholarship handed to them. Oh man, you will love a future show with Dave Kobrine, parent of two youth national champions turned NCAA Division 1 scholarship volleyball players. Asked about his mentoring role to his athletic sons, he relates that he simply rolled a ball out to his first toddler. The kid, Sam, picked it up and started dunking on a toy basket. His younger brother, Kevin, watched and soon followed suit. Repeat daily for 18 years, adjusting occasionally to higher baskets. Simple as that. Dave’s most profound insight about the youth athletic journey: “I just wish I’d read to them more.” Read between the lines and you’ll realize that the success formula as a parent entails allowing a child his or her free will. One parenting book related that kids talk in code such that, “I’m thirsty” might really mean “I want to stop shooting free throws now”. Also, offer unconditional support and enforce a healthy, balanced perspective. Make sure your kids get over themselves.

Unfortunately, it’s become so ridiculous today that high school sports now resemble college sports of past generations, and college sports represent professional sports of the past. In the high school scene, you have kids routinely holding back a grade for non-academic reasons, the better to mature physically and dominate in competition. Two ridiculous examples out emerge out of sports powerhouse Mater Dei High School in Santa Ana, CA. A point guard and top student gets held back not once, but twice (such that he’s nearly 20 when graduating high school!), stars on the court and the classroom, and gains a coveted Ivy League student-athlete opportunity. Current USC quarterback JT Daniels repeats 9th grade to pump iron and get more summer passing league reps, becomes one of the greatest high school quarterbacks in California history, then skips his senior to jump over to USC and earn the starting spot as a freshman. They usually call collegiate athletes who have not redshirted “true freshmen,” but not much about this story rings true or morally acceptable.

We also have the many disturbing high profile examples of peak performers who become incredibly poorly adjusted to normal life, most spectacularly Tiger Woods and Lance Armstrong. What’s great is to see both of these dudes, now in their 40s, work hard to learn and grow from their flameouts and present more mature and well-adjusted public personas in recent years. So if you are young and ambitious, or a parent of people young and ambitious, or someone of any age wondering if you can or should be more than you are, let’s take a deep breath, take a cold plunge and get over ourselves for a moment.

Maybe it’s highly overrated to be a go-getting hustler super performer as glorified today in a 24/7 manner by hyperconnectivity and social media? Maybe it’s healthier to honor your basic nature, strive to be a kind, happy, well-adjusted person who finds a comfortable fit into society, makes a positive contribution, but doesn’t necessarily have to win awards or become famous. Recall the Martin Luther King (remember him?) message to the street-sweepers of the world:

“If a man is called to be a street sweeper, he should sweep streets even as a Michelangelo painted, or Beethoven composed music or Shakespeare wrote poetry. He should sweep streets so well that all the hosts of heaven and earth will pause to say, ‘Here lived a great street sweeper who did his job well.’ “

Back to the Sisson show, Mark’s inspiration as a scrawny high school sophomore from Maine to apply to the most badass prep school in the land was simply an unfiltered, unregulated, uncompromising answering of his calling and his destiny. You can’t will anyone into this type of disposition and mindset–certainly not with a young person, and most likely not with that manager on your team who is underperforming and doesn’t seem to harbor that competitive fire that you wish for him or her. Add to this insight the many detours on Mark’s journey, where he seemingly had it made but hopped off the train to stay true to his calling: bailing on his medical school track to do crazy stuff like run marathons and ironman triathlons and build refrigerated salad bars; bailing on a lucrative job while feeding a young family to take massive risks and go it alone; and also the recent occasion where he stretched himself too thin and embarked on a disastrous restaurant venture that he is still unwinding.

And while we see Mark as a huge success and living the awesome dream life, it’s important to acknowledge that there is an extreme negotiation and price to pay if you are gonna blaze a big trail. The complexity and intensity of Mark’s career life would make most people crack. Recall how Elon Musk told Joe Rogan point blank: “You would not want to trade places with me.” Ditto for Mark. Get this – he thinks he is, “fairly risk averse.” Obviously, his insight comes from his unique point of view, because this guy has been swinging for the fences, buoyed by one from a list of life changing insights he has dispensed to me over the years: “All you need is one home run.

Enjoy the Breather show and be sure to listen to the full-length Ultimate Mark Sisson Interview!

TIMESTAMPS

Mark Sisson, at 12 years old, the entrepreneur is born. [00:00:35]

Execution, and going for it, taking risks, not being afraid to fail, paying your dues are part of Mark’s story. [00:05:18]

The concept of investing in yourself. [00:06:27]

Marks, instead of his being a doctor, saved thousands of people from needing a doctor. [00:07:02]

There is a major backlash to this frenzied energy of believing in yourself and thinking positive and dreaming big. [00:09:09]

If you honor your basic nature and be a good person, that may be the secret to success. [00:12:35]

Mark’s journey had many twists and turns from his applying to a prestigious prep school on his own with dreams of medical school to running marathons and doing triathlons to entrepreneur. [00:15:55]

The lessons learned from his failures only brought Mark more confidence. [00:19:03]

The entrepreneurial spirit captured by the belief that, “All you need is one home run.” [00:20:34]

LINKS:

QUOTES:

“From a young age, I had a desire to contribute to the economy.” – Mark Sisson 

“The best investment you can ever make is in yourself.” – Mark Sisson 

“Striving to become a super performer, hustler, entrepreneur might be overrated.” – Brad

“Perhaps it’s more important to honor your basic nature and not worry about the lofty goals of the planet that are thrown in your face every day.” – Brad

“You wouldn’t want to trade places with me.” – Elon Musk

“All you need is one home run.” – Mark Sisson

“The best way to get there is to keep reinvesting in yourself.” – Mark Sisson

LISTEN:

 

Welcome to the Get Over Yourself Podcast. This is Brad Kearns.

“There might be a little too much blather going on right now and positive energy and self-glorification and narcissism, and not enough focus on stuff like what Mark Sisson’s all about. Which is execution and going for it, taking risks, not being afraid to fail.”

Okay, this is debriefing The Ultimate Mark Sisson Interview show. Go, listen to that awesome show. Whether or not you’re a primal fan or a Mark Sisson fan, it’s a great story and a fascinating entrepreneurial, adventurous journey of life that Mark has lived and detailed so colourfully. I didn’t realize the extent of which he felt stuck in that small town as a kid and dreaming these bigger dreams and having these callings to do something grand and get out of there, and live a bigger life and challenge himself further at a really young age.

I mean, this entrepreneurial gene kicking into gear when he was a preteen mowing lawns and making bank. I love his quote where he says, “I wanted to participate in the economy.” He was 12 or 13-years-old. Now, I felt the same way as a kid of around that age, but my goal of participating in the economy was basically to go down and buy candy at Teff Pharmacy.

Yeah, speaking of that word “entrepreneur”, it seems like this is the coolest, hippest thing to be in the digital age, this social media age. Sometimes to the extent that it seems like you’re a loser if you don’t quit your lame, steady job to travel the world as an Instagram influencer or start a killer new business and make millions of dollars, and become a player at a young age. Oh, my gosh, it’s getting to be a little bit too much.

Actually, Mark and I were talking about this before we hit the record button, so I apologize for that, since I’m trying to record everything. Anyway, we were talking about this and reflecting on how this, “Go, conquer the planet!” is the prevailing theme of today, especially in the podcast scene, and the YouTube scene, and the social media scene. Because after all, who’s doing this? Who’s driving this momentum?

It’s the rare individual who’s compelled to create original content and step off the beaten path to build a brand or create their following or whatever. So, what we’re receiving is a distorted message because the content creators are speaking from their own point of view, and how important it is to follow your own voice and be somebody special and all that stuff.

Casey Neistat, love that guy – the YouTube sensation. He’s now got a great podcast called Couples Therapy. And he had a viral video, the theme of which was “Nobody knows anything”, and you can prove your high school teacher wrong that said you’d never amount to anything. And this was a beautiful motto for him. His path was a beautiful path to follow. He’s a gifted artist, he’s doing a wonderful advancement of culture to be so authentic and tell his story with all his videos.

But, we have to keep his message and his persona in context. Because most people, if they were going to vlog their everyday life happenings, it would be stupid and lame. So, turn off the camera and enjoy your life unless perhaps you’re Casey Neistat, then film it, and bring your art to the world.

So, back to Mark. Remember to listen to this guy because he’s a wise old man. He’s been around, he’s been on a long journey. I’m 53-years-old, so maybe I’m a wise old man too or in that category. Either the old man category or the wise category, whatever your preference is. But Mark said before the show, quote, was something like, “It seems like a lot of content out there is Tony Robbins’ rehash.” And not a criticism of Tony Robbins at all. He’s had a great run. His message has had a lot of impact and a lot of positive influence on a lot of people. He’s also run afoul of the Me Too movement recently.

But I like the guy and I take his message in context, so I don’t plunge into the rabbit hole and get delusional just thinking that spouting Tony Robbins isms is going to be my path to success, happiness and fulfilment in life. Watch the JP Sears parody video of him going to the Tony Robbins event – hilarious. Love that guy, JP Sears. There’s a guy who’s gotten over himself. Doesn’t take himself too seriously, and conveys a really serious and important message using humor.

Anyway, the point is, there might be a little too much blather going on right now and positive energy and self-glorification and narcissism, and not enough focus on stuff like what Mark Sisson’s all about. Which is execution and going for it, taking risks, not being afraid to fail, paying your dues, at times, paying a severe price. And in contrast, we have these dynamics today of, for example, the helicopter parenting trend and the overemphasis on social media, on outside attention and accolades, instead of appreciating the journey, and focusing on the process rather than the accumulation of end results.

I hate to make sweeping generalizations here, but there’s a common theme of people complaining about Millennials; that they’re impatient, they want things right away, they’re not willing to pay the price. I’m not sure if Mark said this on the lengthy show or not, but he said, “You know, there’s a shortage of skilled laborers in the world today.” Did you know that? We’re talking like contractors, builders, welders, electricians. And Mark was saying that if you honor one of his life changing insights (so I proclaim that to be), where he says, “Invest in yourself.” That’s the best investment you can ever make. Invest in your further education, invest in your own business, that kind of thing, and grow that way. He mentioned that if you spend a few grand going to welding school, you can leverage that into a six-figure job right now, because there’s this shortage.

Oh, my gosh. Anyway, back to Mark’s journey and reflecting on all the twists and turns and detours and dead ends. You know, if it was Mark today, going this route where he had those skills and that drive and those attributes, maybe he would have been a doctor like he dreamed about being when he was younger. And of course, that’s fine, it’s a wonderful career. But his path was different, and his path was to save 10 million people from needing a doctor, from that steady decline into old age caused by living according to conventional wisdom.

I’m not kidding. I mean, look at the marksdailyapple.com success stories and imagine this being multiplied by the power of the movement and people transitioning away from that standard American diet and reclaiming their health before plunging into the downward spiral. That is the western medical care and the accelerated aging caused by our prevailing lifestyle habits. And that’s been Mark’s mission statement for over a decade – that he wants to influence 10 million lives. And it’s a pretty ambitious statement, but you know what? Day by day he’s working hard to do that. He’s getting his products out there, and he’s got his message out there.

The blog grew tremendously from its modest start in the early years. And I remember someone repurposing that mission statement one upping him. I can’t remember who, I’m sorry, and apologize for calling you out on this show, whoever you are. But the person’s mission statement said that their goal was to influence 100 million lives. Not just 10 million, like little Mark Sisson, but $100 million. Oh my gosh, if you know who I’m talking about, whatever. All right, good luck with you.

But it’s kind of what I’m trying to point out here about this age of self-glorification and positive talk rather than backing it up and actually doing something about it. And in Mark’s case, he’s put up a bloody blog post every day for 12 years to back up that mission statement, whether he falls short of 10 million and there’s only 9 million readers or whatever. You get me? All right, big difference.

Yeah, there is a major backlash to this frenzied energy of believing in yourself and thinking positive and dreaming big and the idea that you can do anything, especially today with the hyper speed hyperconnected age and the golden childs and their helicopter parents. Oh, my gosh. Today, we seem to want to force destiny upon, especially the parent, upon the little golden child and make every kid a valedictorian through pure effort and pure orchestration of every single day. A valedictorian or a division one athlete, take your pick. It’s absolutely become ridiculous.

I like to pick on the high school sports example because today, high school sports resembles what college sports was a generation ago. And of course, the college sports scene with all the money and hype and interest in TV coverage is now what pro sports was a generation ago. Routinely, in high school athletic scene, being held back a grade or even two grades by their parents, purely for athletic reasons to get an artificial edge, dominate because of their older age and advanced maturity and then go on to a college athletic experience.

You have kids in high school transferring to another school if they don’t get the starting job come football season. My favorite ridiculous example is the current quarterback for USC, JT Daniels. A true freshman who won the starting job upon his arrival to campus. And what this kid did was, he held back a grade before high school so he could come in and dominate. And he dominated to such extent, one of the greatest high school quarterbacks ever in California. He decided to skip his senior year and head over to USC to get his college career started early because he pretty much had had his way with his high school opponents. So, hold back, dominate, and then skip a grade. Come on, it’s ridiculous and it’s taking advantage of all the kids who play by the rules.

Then we have, furthering this theme, the most profound example of a peak performer who has incredibly poorly adjusted to normal life and to being an all-around good person. And that would be Tiger Woods. And go read the phenomenal new biography, titled Tiger Woods by two prominent authors. It’s been a long-time interviewing hundreds of people to get the true and complete story of how this whole thing came about, and the disastrous influence of his father who was solely focused on developing this kid to become a cyborg – the greatest golfer of all time, which he greatly succeeded in.

But, then we had a little bit of a train wreck situation afterward. You could probably put Lance Armstrong in the same category, who was so driven and obsessed with winning and gaining wealth and fame that he didn’t handle the big picture very well. Especially, the way that he handled the doping strategy, which was the prevailing strategy for all the athletes. But you know, he kind of took that and went with it in a disastrous direction.

Cool thing about both of those guys, they’re grown up, man. They’re both in their 40s. They seem to be better adjusted. It’s beautiful to see Tiger Woods come back. It’s great to listen to Lance do his Forward Podcast, and congratulations, keep it up guys.

Anyway, so, if you’re a young, ambitious listener right now, if you’re a parent of young, ambitious kids or you’re someone of any age who wonders if you can be more than you are right now or should be more than you are right now, let’s all take a deep breath, take a cold plunge and get over ourselves. Maybe it’s overrated, extremely overrated to strive to become and to realize a goal of becoming a super performer and a real hustler, an entrepreneur. Maybe it’s more important to honor your basic nature and not worry about the lofty goals of the planet that are thrown in your face every single day.

After all, in many ways, we have enough doctors, lawyers, CEOs, elected officials, you know what I mean? They’re already out there. And if you honor your basic nature and find your true calling and your passions and figure out a way to be happy and fulfilled along the way and to be a good person, wow, maybe that’s the secret.

I just talked to a mom who was explaining her son’s in college and she said, “You know, this guy is probably going to be a lawyer and he’ll be a great lawyer. But he’s not going to be that lawyer that’s standing up in the courtroom arguing his case. He’s going to be a guy at his desk doing wonderful intellectual work. That’s just the type of person he is.” I like Judge Smails Quip in the classic movie Caddyshack, when he told Danny Noonan, when Danny Noonan was sucking up to him, trying to schmooze maybe an opportunity to get him to pay for his education. And Judge Smails said, “Well, you know, the world needs ditch diggers too.”

You know what? Maybe the average person might have a chance or might be on average more happy than this Elon Musk prototype, who told Joe Rogan during the podcast that, “You wouldn’t want to trade places with me.” And he was not kidding, you know. These people that are pushing the very edge of human performance and maximum brain use and maximum complexity and pressure and significance and fame and attention, maybe it doesn’t equate very well with being happy. We see that with the celebrities every single day, and they’re having a tough time negotiating real life.

I can reference my time when I was a triathlete for those nine years. It was absolutely a dream job, it was a dream come true. It was an opportunity for me to pursue this incredibly, challenging and compelling career where I learned the lessons of life and success and failure in such an intense and dramatic manner. So many good things about it, but I’ll also reference during that timeframe, I was living on the absolute edge of my physical capabilities every single day for 10 years. I was on the edge of exhaustion every day. And that’s a tough way to live life in many ways. Difficult to obtain the happiness and fulfilment and contentment that maybe a more balanced life offers. That’s why it’s good to have phases of life that are intense, and then you can kind of transition out of that and pursue different goals and always keep things fresh and interesting and exciting.

So, anyway, back to that point in Mark’s story where he decided after 10th grade, that things were getting stale in his little small fishing village in Maine, and he decided on his own to apply to the one of the most badass prep schools in the entire country as a scrawny little dude from Maine. He just realized that it was his calling and his destiny, and there were no helicopter parental influences in the way. He just grabbed the application, probably mailed away for it, put a stamp on the envelope, and wow,

I mean, this place is legit.

This Phillips Exeter Academy alumni include 19 US senators, President Pierce, Mark Zuckerberg from Facebook, Dan Brown – writing the Davinci code, and Sacha Baron Cohen. Okay, not really with Sacha Baron Cohen. But what a great actor and Mark did meet him on the beach in Malibu one day, so he gets to go in this story.

Anyway, back to Mark’s story. You cannot force or fake this type of disposition and comportment and mindset. Same for the many detours that occurred on his journey where he bailed on his med school dream and went to go run marathons and do triathlons and crazy stuff. You remember the point where he bailed on this lucrative, high paying cush job, selling vitamins for his friend’s company? This is when he had a wife and two young kids and instead, plunged into debt and a huge risk to go it alone and try to build his own company. He was just compelled to do so.

I think when we make mistakes in life and we have regrets, is when we force things to happen rather than being intuitive, going with the flow and realizing our callings and our destinies and paying attention to those voices rather than forcing those voices and like pretending you wrote the script, but it’s not really true.

You can celebrate Mark as this hugely successful guy living the dream life, living awesome at the top of the hill in Malibu or at the top of the high rise in Miami. But there’s an extreme negotiation and an extreme price to pay if you’re going to blaze a big-time trail. I want everyone to realize this clearly. I’ve been close up to see the incredible intensity and complexity of Mark’s life, and it’s not something for the faint of heart. You have to have giant wave of [Spanish 00:18:20] – to use español [Spanish 00:18:22].

Look at, I mean again, Elon Musk saying, “You would not want to trade places with me, period.” Same thing for Mark. And when you hear a quote from him like that he’s fairly risk averse, you could hear me burst out laughing. I’m like, “Seriously?” Because most people would say this guy is a swashbuckler by comparison to the people that are changing the allocation of their portfolios from 60% equities to 65% (ooh, going out on a limb).

Anyway, what Mark does, is he plunges all in with incredible intensity and confidence and bravado sometimes. And you heard him talk about the lessons learned from his failed restaurant venture last year, which was incredibly stressful and he’s still unwinding from. But he sounds so well adjusted and he says, “Hey, it’s over. Moving on, live and learn, and you can’t let yourself get down from failure.” And that’s where so many people give up and just end up telling a story for the rest of their life. They get beaten down by the competitive nature of daily life and they cannot get back up and dust themselves off, and that’s what makes a successful entrepreneur or a successful person. Whether it’s a parent in a relationship, any kind of job, career or school, is getting up and going for it again and again and again.

You can hear that intensity and enthusiasm and passion in Mark’s voice every time he’s on a podcast or you bump into him on the street in Miami or New York City.

Yeah, speaking to that, I remember this is now almost 10 years ago when we were just getting going and getting the Primal Blueprint out of the gate, and we were in New York City and some passerbys recognized him. “Hey, you Mark Sisson?” And I’m like, “You know what, dude? That’s pretty awesome. I have high hopes for this movement now. When you get recognized on the street in New York City, you know that your blogging is favorable and success is predicted.”

Anyway, another life changing insight off the list is “All you need is one home run.” And that should be the mantra of every entrepreneur who can get up, dust themselves off and go for it again. And know (this is from Mark again) that probably the best way to get there is to keep reinvesting in yourself. We didn’t say believing in yourself, we said reinvesting in yourself and doing something. Going back and getting education, signing up for the primal health coach course, reading new information, talking to people, networking – reinvesting and then taking action.

You know what? What’s a home run anyway? For some people it’s hitting the big money; that’s great. But what about as Mark said, during the show, having friends, having enough food to eat, having a shelter or a place to sleep, and enjoying the journey along the way. What more do you really need?

Reminds me of the book, The Alchemist, the legendary bestseller by Paulo Coelho, where the shepherd boy at the end finally discovers the pot of gold that he was searching for. And the message practically brings you to tears, right there, reading it in the pages.

Yeah, the pot of gold you’ve been searching for is right here in front of you, every single day, thanks for listening.

Hey, do you want to hear an advertisement? If I sing it, would that be a little more palatable? I know that we sometimes get annoyed listening to ads on podcasts. Go ahead and hit the plus 15 or the plus 32nd button if you don’t want to hear this. But I’ve also been exposed to some cool products and services when I listen to ads on certain podcasts. So, once in a while or more than that, I’m going to talk about stuff that I really use and enjoy and completely support. No BS, I absolutely promise that to you.

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Thank you for listening to this lengthy ad, and I appreciate you listening this show, also.

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